I consider Ross' request perfectly reasonable. I actually have done some of these for Marta. More to the point, I don't think that anyone ought, in principle, decide that any particular notation is not important enough to do, just because some especial package doesn't do it. I don't even exclude the upside-down ampersand, although I don't care for it at all. As I just got finished saying on another forum, we ought to be trying to include people, not exclude them. By the way, I considered the pitiful attempt to do commutative diagrams in AMS-TeX as AMS' expression of their contempt for category theory, rather than as any genunine attempt to accommodate us. Michael ==============================================================================